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Pentax Full Frame; first glimpse


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#1 dave's clichés

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 07:30 PM

 Adorama, first glimpse of the Pentax Full Frame with tilty-swivel screen, due out spring next year!

 

 

 

http://www.adorama.c...ll-frame-dslr?k

 

    They sure have made a "lunar landing module" of the LCD rear screen.

 

    Pentax look to have pulled out all the stops with design of this FF DLSR!

 

 

 

           The question remains as to the sensor's MP counts.

 

 

                Like the K3II no sign of on board flash!



#2 Brightcolours

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Posted 03 December 2015 - 09:56 AM

http://www.pentax.com/en/pentaxff/



#3 Klaus

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Posted 04 December 2015 - 02:34 AM

It surely looks quite compact. Whether it'll appeal to users beyond their existing user-base - especially with just a handful of full format lenses - is another question.

 

IMHO they are too late in betting on the wrong horse. Given their expertise in miniaturization they should have done the Sony thing (A7x).


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#4 Kunzite

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Posted 04 December 2015 - 10:59 AM

It looks like a somewhat taller K-3:

http://cameratimes.o...ize-comparison/

 

I don't think it's too late nor that DSLRs are "the wrong horse". We have an example of  a company which weren't late, and bet on the supposedly "right horse": Samsung ;)

 

Ricoh/Pentax might be just in time, entering the FF segment as DSLRs are still going strong and with a small, but significant user base to build on. That, IMO, is their best option right now - and what would allow them further expansion, including to a large sensor MILC system.

 

As for expertise in miniaturization, I'd say their skills are different of that of an electronic giant like Sony. They might not be able to miniaturize electronics as much, and they might not be willing to compromise too much.



#5 Klaus

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Posted 04 December 2015 - 11:06 AM

It looks like a somewhat taller K-3:

http://cameratimes.o...ize-comparison/

 

I don't think it's too late nor that DSLRs are "the wrong horse". We have an example of  a company which weren't late, and bet on the supposedly "right horse": Samsung ;)

 

Ricoh/Pentax might be just in time, entering the FF segment as DSLRs are still going strong and with a small, but significant user base to build on. That, IMO, is their best option right now - and what would allow them further expansion, including to a large sensor MILC system.

 

As for expertise in miniaturization, I'd say their skills are different of that of an electronic giant like Sony. They might not be able to miniaturize electronics as much, and they might not be willing to compromise too much.

 

Samsung did EVERYTHING wrong. And they even tried it with DSLRs before going mirrorless ...


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#6 Brightcolours

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Posted 04 December 2015 - 11:53 AM

Samsung did EVERYTHING wrong. And they even tried it with DSLRs before going mirrorless ...

Yeah, they went APS-C mirrorless. And offered some good optics. And tried to bring a real usable sportsshooting mirrorless, the NX1, apparently too late and not realizing they do not have the name, nor the line up, and that FF still is some kind of holy grail for many.

 

Mirrorless is still not gaining big market share (for varied reasons), and that small pie gets divided up by many companies (Sony, Canon, Nikon, Samsung, Fuji, Olympus, Leica, Panasonic, forgetting Pentax Q since it is rather silly). Thinking Pentax should try to introduce another mirrorless line with new lens line up, seems a bit naive?

 

At least with a FF DSLR they have a certain client base to build upon for the foreseeable future. A new mirrorless adventure will suck up too much financial resources, at Pentax' current state.


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#7 Kunzite

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Posted 04 December 2015 - 01:33 PM

What he said ^^

With an emphasis on the last paragraph. There isn't much choice IMO, Pentax/Ricoh has to grow using the existing user base; after that, more options will become available. The alternative? Risk everything in the hope that a MILC-centered strategy might bring them, after many years of heavy losses, to where they are today.

 

The Samsung case, but also e.g. Olympus who barely managed to get into black show that going MILC does not guarantee success. Pentax continual survival (despite Hoya) shows that staying DSLR can work.


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#8 popo

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Posted 04 December 2015 - 01:38 PM

Mirrorless is still not gaining big market share (for varied reasons)


Depends on how you measure it. I understood mirrorless unit sales were roughly holding steady, compared to an ongoing decline in DSLR numbers. So of the interchangeable lens share, they are growing in proportion.

As for Pentax... Didn't they do that mirrorless with DSLR mount in the past? I have to wonder, if you put aside size optimisations, could they do something with that going forward? It may make more sense for a higher end FF mirrorless.

dA Canon 7D2, 7D, 5D2, 600D, 450D, 300D IR modified, 1D, EF-S 10-18, 15-85, EF 35/2, 85/1.8, 135/2, 70-300L, 100-400L, MP-E65, Zeiss 2/50, Sigma 150 macro, 120-300/2.8, Samyang 8mm fisheye, Olympus E-P1, Panasonic 20/1.7, Sony HX9V, Fuji X100.


#9 Brightcolours

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Posted 04 December 2015 - 02:44 PM

Depends on how you measure it. I understood mirrorless unit sales were roughly holding steady, compared to an ongoing decline in DSLR numbers. So of the interchangeable lens share, they are growing in proportion.

As for Pentax... Didn't they do that mirrorless with DSLR mount in the past? I have to wonder, if you put aside size optimisations, could they do something with that going forward? It may make more sense for a higher end FF mirrorless.

What is the point of doing something "mirrorless" without making the camera compact through removing the mirrorbox? I do not get why a mirror itself is something evil or bad. Removing the mirrorbox, making a short flange distance possible and making a thinner body possible, that has its reasons.



#10 Kunzite

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Posted 04 December 2015 - 03:19 PM

Looking at the CIPA website, the DSLR decline slowed down. 8,203,656 SLR units were made, from January to October, compared to 2,727,004 MILCs (I don't think they're counting Samsung and Leica, though).



#11 popo

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Posted 04 December 2015 - 07:50 PM

@BC You're reading something I didn't intend in there. Still, you already know the advantages and disadvantages of with or without mirrors, and you know I'm still primarily a Canon user so I have no hatred of mirrors here.

I guess my point is, what if you want to offer the mirrorless experience, but don't want or can't create a new lens lineup for it? You lose the possible size reduction and keep with SLR lenses. If you're aiming higher end anyway, the size isn't critical, and maybe even turn it around to pack in more "stuff" like a half decent battery size...

dA Canon 7D2, 7D, 5D2, 600D, 450D, 300D IR modified, 1D, EF-S 10-18, 15-85, EF 35/2, 85/1.8, 135/2, 70-300L, 100-400L, MP-E65, Zeiss 2/50, Sigma 150 macro, 120-300/2.8, Samyang 8mm fisheye, Olympus E-P1, Panasonic 20/1.7, Sony HX9V, Fuji X100.


#12 UH

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Posted 04 December 2015 - 08:40 PM

I'd like a FF camera with the K-Mount. If I screw a DA lens onto the body I'd only use the center part of the sensor, if I'd use a FA lens I'd use the complete sensor. This would be fine for me.

For Pentax it's not so difficult to build a 'classic' DSLR body that contains K-Mount and a bigger sensor.

Does this make sense ?



#13 Brightcolours

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Posted 04 December 2015 - 09:43 PM

I'd like a FF camera with the K-Mount. If I screw a DA lens onto the body I'd only use the center part of the sensor, if I'd use a FA lens I'd use the complete sensor. This would be fine for me.

For Pentax it's not so difficult to build a 'classic' DSLR body that contains K-Mount and a bigger sensor.

Does this make sense ?

That is exactly what Pentax is doing



#14 Kunzite

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Posted 05 December 2015 - 01:55 PM

Guess what's the subject of this thread  ;)

 

It cannot be a K-mount FF DSLR body, but a K-mount FF product line. And Ricoh Imaging started introducing the first products from this K-mount FF product line this spring: the D FA 150-450mm, and more recently the 24-70mm (a 70-200mm is delayed for last-minute changes).

Expect a camera announcement at CP+ (and, of course, more lenses).



#15 Kunzite

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Posted 24 December 2015 - 11:57 AM

The teaser site was once again updated (are they targeting once every 2 weeks updates?).

This week's subject: the crop function. They're showing low res samples taken with DA* 55mm, DA* 300mm, DA 560mm (this one being declared 'incompatible with FF' by a certain Pentax forum ;) ).

http://www.pentax.com/en/pentaxff/



#16 dave's clichés

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Posted 28 December 2015 - 09:24 AM

Samsung did EVERYTHING wrong. And they even tried it with DSLRs before going mirrorless ...

 

 " I don't think Samsung did everything wrong at all"......(it was just that it took a while to finally get it right)......which in boardroom terms was too long........otherwise you could say the same about Sony........Sony went through a ton of directions and models before they "fell" upon the right route and now they are on track all that doubtless frighteningly expensive route is starting to pay dividends......

   

  Samsung did the same with many uninspiring cameras until the NX1....in my view they were on the threshold of having created a winning formula....but financially someone in the Boardroom decided to pull the plug....maybe the difference was that Sony had lost so many of it's markets with TV/computers that they knew they had to go the course with something.....Samsung has been gaining!

 I've some hopes for the division., but they are hopes!

 

  Pentax on the other-hand is a company that had it all and allowed it to slip away and are now showing how hard it is to retrieve it all back.  This FF DSLR will sell to die hard Pentaxians who have legacy lenses, but their new FF optics are sparse and not cheap. Unless they can pull the rabbit out of the hat with their new body it's going to be a struggling attracting new buyers from Canonikon land, without talking about their constant delays.

  Their saving grace is they have been operating in the black!



#17 Klaus

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Posted 29 January 2016 - 11:53 AM

Well, not cheap? Have you noticed the price of the Pentax 24-70mm f/2.8 and 150-450mm ?

RELATIVELY speaking they are very affordable. Especially the 24-70mm - this one is an absolute bargain.


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#18 JoJu

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Posted 29 January 2016 - 01:37 PM

Well, Dave, the question is, will you give up your Nikon to go back to Pentax? Anybody willing to pay for Pentax FF? I mean, not the usual "if they offer this or that, I'll jump the boat!" - no "ifs" please, just, "hell yes, I've been waiting for Pentax all the last ten years, now I already preordered, even

  1. if the lens choice is not that big and third party lenses are dated or unavailable
  2. if all other accessoires are made for Canon or Nikon or from Sony
  3. if all RAW converters will take a little while to go Pentax - or I decide to use this fat DNG file format which usually wastes more disk space than anything else around except TIF
  4. if it remains questionable into which future we're steering: 60 year old mirror concept or mirrorless right now?"

Pentax once had gorgeous offerings for Professionals, the whole LX system was sort of on par with a Nikon F3 or better - but not many were interested. I don't know about the market share and for sure I'm not always happy with Nikon's decisions. But if it comes to Pentax, I'm done. Made my experiences and sold the whole stuff, never looked back. The screen is very innobative IMO - but that's just one detail. At least and after decades, articulated screen made it into a Nikon Pro DX, so it IS cool and usefull. But you're too late, Pentax. Again.



#19 robbiec

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Posted 16 February 2016 - 03:54 PM

Specs as known at this moment in time:

 

36.4MP CMOS sensor. No low pass filter. 
- Real resolution (pixel shift) 
- Image processing engine PRIME IV 
- Sensor Size: 35.9 x 24.0mm 
- Video is full HD 60p 
- 4K interval movie 
- 14-bit RAW 
- DR II 
- KAF2 mount (KAF3, KAF2, KAF, KA, compatible with power zoom lens) 
- AF sensor SAFOX12. AF point is 33 points (25 points are cross-type). -3EV Correspondence 
- AF assist light 
- Viewfinder magnification 0.70 times. 100% field of view 
- Natural-Bright-Matte III focusing screen
- LCD monitor 3.2 inches 1,037,000 dot. Flexible tilting 
- GPS built-in. Wi-Fi built-in 
- Shutter unit of the compact new design. Durability is 300,000 shots 
- Shutter speed is 30 seconds -1/8000 seconds. Synchro speed is 1/200 sec 
- Media SD / SDHC / SDXC (UHS-I). Dual card slot 
- USB terminal (USB2.0, micro B), HDMI terminal (type D) 
- Microphone jack, a headphone jack, X contact 
- 5-axis camera shake correction. Effective for five stops. 
- Electronic Level 
- Photometry sensor 86000 pixel RGB sensor 
- ISO range is 100-204800 
- Continuous shooting 4.4 frames / sec (full size). 6.5 frames / sec. (APS-C) 
- Buffer 70 shots JPEG, 17 shots RAW (when full-size 4.4 frames / sec.) 
- The battery is D-LI90 
- Battery life is 760 shots 
- The body is magnesium alloy and stainless steel. Dust and water resistant. -10 Degrees of resistance to low temperature 
- Size: 136.5 x110 x 85.5mm 
- Weight: 925g

I think the ISO is incorrect - confirmation in a day or two.

 

Lens to be released:

 

HD PENTAX-D FA 15-30mm f/2.8 ED SDM WR
- HD coating
- Optical formula: 18 elements (including 3 ED elements and 3 aspherical elements) in 13 groups
- Minimum focusing distance: 0.28m
- Maximum magnification: 0.20x
- Number of aperture blades: 9
- Drip-proof (WR)
- Ultrasonic motor
- Quick Shift focus
- No filter can be mounted
- Super Protect coating on the outer surface of the front element
- Total length: 143.5mm
- Maximum diameter: 98.5mm
- Weight: 1,040g
 

HD PENTAX-D FA 28-105mm f/3.5-5.6 ED DC WR
- HD coating
- Optical formula: 15 elements (including 2 aspherical elements, 1 ED element and 1 made of glass with anomalous dispersion) in 11 groups
- Quick Shift focus
- Minimum focusing distance: 0.5m
- Maximum magnification: 0.22x
- Filter size: 62mm
- Number of aperture blades: 9
- Drip-proof (WR)
- Super Protect coating on the outer surface of the front element
- DC motor
- Total length: 86.5mm
- Maximum diameter: 73mm
- Weight: 440g

 



#20 JoJu

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Posted 16 February 2016 - 04:13 PM

The 15-30 is a "Pentax"-labelled Tamron (except the WR-part? Is the Tamron originally weather-resistant?) Doesn't have to be a bad thing. What Leica can do with brushed up Panasonics and Hasselblad with Sonys, Ricoh can also do. I just don't think, servicewise it's a cool idea. One lens to Pentax, the other to Tamron.

 

USB 2.0 is a joke, a pretty bad one, too. And the rest are nice specs. Just: who cares about another FF DSLR?






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