i'm thinking of getting into nikon, these has been on my mind for a while now, probably a d300s. i started looking at what lenses i'll get when i go nikon, i got my eye on the 24mm f/1.4g, 50mm f/1.4g and the 85mm f/1.4g. according to the review here on photozone all these g lenses shifts focus stopped down, there's a chart on the review which shows this, would this be noticeable in real world shooting? is it that bad? i hear a lot of complaints from canon 50mm f/1.2L users regarding focus shift and how it ruins the entire photo.
anyone here experience focus shift with these nikons?
thank you
[quote name='fall' timestamp='1306399862' post='8822']
i'm thinking of getting into nikon, these has been on my mind for a while now, probably a d300s. i started looking at what lenses i'll get when i go nikon, i got my eye on the 24mm f/1.4g, 50mm f/1.4g and the 85mm f/1.4g. according to the review here on photozone all these g lenses shifts focus stopped down, there's a chart on the review which shows this, would this be noticeable in real world shooting? is it that bad? i hear a lot of complaints from canon 50mm f/1.2L users regarding focus shift and how it ruins the entire photo.
anyone here experience focus shift with these nikons?
thank you
[/quote]
I'm not sure if all the samples of a lens do suffer from focus shift, not neccessarily... Therefore, I think the best thing you can do is to check the lens before you buy it.
@Markus & Klaus (concerning the LoCA / Bokeh Fringing tests shots): Can you please specify info regarding the focused spot, the distance from focused spot and increments of the ruler (cm. or inches)... I was always asking myself if these are essential or not, and I think this might be the right time to ask for an additional info for that part of the report.
Regards,
Serkan
thanks for the reply puxavida. i was thinking of switching from canon to nikon, i was hoping to get some more info about these lenses before i sell my current setup, i dont have a nikon body yet to test these lenses on <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='  ' /> . if the focus shift is that bad, i'd probably just stay with canon.
hopefully someone who had experience with these lenses can help me out.
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[quote name='fall' timestamp='1306538032' post='8862']
thanks for the reply puxavida. i was thinking of switching from canon to nikon, i was hoping to get some more info about these lenses before i sell my current setup, i dont have a nikon body yet to test these lenses on <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=' ' /> . if the focus shift is that bad, i'd probably just stay with canon.
hopefully someone who had experience with these lenses can help me out.
[/quote]
Which lenses do you have now? And what camera do you have now?
A 24mm f1.4 seems to be a kind of strange choice for APS-C... Or rather, a D300s is a bit of a strange choice for the FF 24mm, which turns into a 35mm f2. A FF body with 35mm f2 lens would seem a more logical choice to most?
Same for the other lenses... 50mm f1.4 -> 85mm f1.8 is a good equivalent on FF, much cheaper too.
85mm f1.4 -> 135mm f2.
So... going full frame will be cheaper, as the lenses will be MUCH more affordable....
And why the change (any reason, even nonsensical ones, is fine... just curious, as the 7D does not really have to hide for the D300s)?
And it is not like the Canon lenses are worse either?
Anyway, those are my questions... why not going FF, as the lenses you list only really make sense on FF, and on FF you can get the same with way cheaper lenses for the same results...
[quote name='Brightcolours' timestamp='1306565425' post='8864']
Which lenses do you have now? And what camera do you have now?
A 24mm f1.4 seems to be a kind of strange choice for APS-C... Or rather, a D300s is a bit of a strange choice for the FF 24mm, which turns into a 35mm f2. A FF body with 35mm f2 lens would seem a more logical choice to most?
Same for the other lenses... 50mm f1.4 -> 85mm f1.8 is a good equivalent on FF, much cheaper too.
85mm f1.4 -> 135mm f2.
So... going full frame will be cheaper, as the lenses will be MUCH more affordable....
And why the change (any reason, even nonsensical ones, is fine... just curious, as the 7D does not really have to hide for the D300s)?
And it is not like the Canon lenses are worse either?
Anyway, those are my questions... why not going FF, as the lenses you list only really make sense on FF, and on FF you can get the same with way cheaper lenses for the same results...
[/quote]
i have a 7d, a 24mm and a 100mm.
what i like in the nikon side is that spot metering is tied to which ever af point you are using, i think canon also offers this featured but only on the 1d line.
i like it that the d300s has 51 af points. even though all 19 points on the 7d are cross type, i've read that the ones on the d300s is just as quick and just as accurate, i cant say for sure though.
i like how nikon's battery grip has its own joystick or controller so choosing af points while holding the camera in portrait orientation isn't very difficult, i'm having a hard time reaching the main dial at the back of the 7d when griped.
also, some nikon lenses can be used on m4/3 without losing aperture control. my dslr and m4/3 camera can share lenses.
canon is great, but i guess i'm a little curious, and would like to try nikon. <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='  ' />
my reasons might be petty, but if i can find a good deal for my canon then why not?
i have thought about going full frame before, but i hear that af on the 5ds aren't very reliable...i guess if i'm going nikon i can get a d700 and start with a 35mm and slowly build my set up from their.
still, i'm curious about the focus shift on nikon primes and would like to hear from those who have experienced this. <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=' ' />
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[quote name='fall' timestamp='1306575591' post='8869']
i have a 7d, a 24mm and a 100mm.
what i like in the nikon side is that spot metering is tied to which ever af point you are using, i think canon also offers this featured but only on the 1d line.
i like it that the d300s has 51 af points. even though all 19 points on the 7d are cross type, i've read that the ones on the d300s is just as quick and just as accurate, i cant say for sure though.
i like how nikon's battery grip has its own joystick or controller so choosing af points while holding the camera in portrait orientation isn't very difficult, i'm having a hard time reaching the main dial at the back of the 7d when griped.
also, some nikon lenses can be used on m4/3 without losing aperture control. my dslr and m4/3 camera can share lenses.
canon is great, but i guess i'm a little curious, and would like to try nikon. <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=' ' />
my reasons might be petty, but if i can find a good deal for my canon then why not?
i have thought about going full frame before, but i hear that af on the 5ds aren't very reliable...i guess if i'm going nikon i can get a d700 and start with a 35mm and slowly build my set up from their.
still, i'm curious about the focus shift on nikon primes and would like to hear from those who have experienced this. <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=' ' />
[/quote]
The G lenses (all 3) will lose you the aperture control on micro 4/3rds... The lenses I mentioned concerning the full frame option (with much cheaper lenses doing the same) all have an aperture control ring (35mm f2, 85mm f1.8, 135mm f2 DC).
Concerning cross type sensors or not, cross type is not per definition more quick or accurate. It is just that with line sensors, it can happen that a texture which shows detail/edges in a certain diraction may not be detected (does not happen often, but it can happen). A cross type sensor avoids that in those cases.
The AF speed has nothing to do with the type of AF point, has more to do with the camera's AF module (the computing power of it) and the lens mounted. The 85mm f1.4 and 50mm f1.4 AF-S lenses you list are no speed demons. The 24mm f1.4 is speedy enough to be called "fast". The lenses I listed as alternatives on FF are all screw driven, fast enough for what they are designed for but no speed demons either.
So.. AF speed wise, you won't go a step forward. Generally the 7D is a tad faster in acquiring focus, but a lot depends on the lens mounted. Anyway, the lens types you list are not really designed for tasks where AF speed is a real issue, either. Only the Canon 85mm f1.8 USM is often used for indoor sports shooting, because it has such lightning fast AF.
And it is fine if your reasons are petty. They are your reasons.
[quote name='fall' timestamp='1306575591' post='8869']
...
what i like in the nikon side is that spot metering is tied to which ever af point you are using, i think canon also offers this featured but only on the 1d line.
[/quote]
I didn't know that... It feels like "a must have" functionality but I'm not sure it is a good reason to migrate to Nikon though...
Quote:still, i'm curious about the focus shift on nikon primes and would like to hear from those who have experienced this. <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' />
I have the following Nikon primes and none of them show focus shift (and I usually use the 20mm, 50mm, 85mm and occasionally the 105mm Ai-S set to close focus):
- AF 20mm f/2.8D
- AF 50mm f/1.8D
- AF 85mm f/1.8
- AF-S 105mm micro VR f/2.8
- Ai-S 105mm f/1.8
- Ai-S 135mm f/2.8
But again... I believe this does not change the fact that a lens should be bought after trying it.
Serkan
[quote name='PuxaVida' timestamp='1306602716' post='8881']
I didn't know that... It feels like "a must have" functionality but I'm not sure it is a good reason to migrate to Nikon though...
I have the following Nikon primes and none of them show focus shift (and I usually use the 20mm, 50mm, 85mm and occasionally the 105mm Ai-S set to close focus):
- AF 20mm f/2.8D
- AF 50mm f/1.8D
- AF 85mm f/1.8
- AF-S 105mm micro VR f/2.8
- Ai-S 105mm f/1.8
- Ai-S 135mm f/2.8
But again... I believe this does not change the fact that a lens should be bought after trying it.
Serkan
[/quote]
of course i'll be trying it out first before i buy them <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=' ' /> , i dont have a nikon body to try them out with, i have to sell my canon body before i can get a d300s , and if people are experiencing bad focus shift then i would just stay with canon and not bother <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=' ' />
thanks for the info on those prime, i looked into them and they are cheaper than the g version, and as you said, no focus shift <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=' ' /> , also they have aperture rings for my m4/3. i'll be considering them.
thank you
[quote name='Brightcolours' timestamp='1306581583' post='8870']
The G lenses (all 3) will lose you the aperture control on micro 4/3rds... The lenses I mentioned concerning the full frame option (with much cheaper lenses doing the same) all have an aperture control ring (35mm f2, 85mm f1.8, 135mm f2 DC).
Concerning cross type sensors or not, cross type is not per definition more quick or accurate. It is just that with line sensors, it can happen that a texture which shows detail/edges in a certain diraction may not be detected (does not happen often, but it can happen). A cross type sensor avoids that in those cases.
The AF speed has nothing to do with the type of AF point, has more to do with the camera's AF module (the computing power of it) and the lens mounted. The 85mm f1.4 and 50mm f1.4 AF-S lenses you list are no speed demons. The 24mm f1.4 is speedy enough to be called "fast". The lenses I listed as alternatives on FF are all screw driven, fast enough for what they are designed for but no speed demons either.
So.. AF speed wise, you won't go a step forward. Generally the 7D is a tad faster in acquiring focus, but a lot depends on the lens mounted. Anyway, the lens types you list are not really designed for tasks where AF speed is a real issue, either. Only the Canon 85mm f1.8 USM is often used for indoor sports shooting, because it has such lightning fast AF.
And it is fine if your reasons are petty. They are your reasons.
[/quote]
thanks for the info, i always thought that the purpose of cross type points are for faster and more accurate af, i guess i was wrong. <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=' ' />
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[quote name='fall' timestamp='1306399862' post='8822']
i'm thinking of getting into nikon, these has been on my mind for a while now, probably a d300s. i started looking at what lenses i'll get when i go nikon, i got my eye on the 24mm f/1.4g, 50mm f/1.4g and the 85mm f/1.4g. according to the review here on photozone all these g lenses shifts focus stopped down, there's a chart on the review which shows this, would this be noticeable in real world shooting? is it that bad? i hear a lot of complaints from canon 50mm f/1.2L users regarding focus shift and how it ruins the entire photo.
anyone here experience focus shift with these nikons?
thank you
[/quote]
Just one comment as to focus shift with 50L: first of all, one of the people who was most vociferous and had the biggest problems with regard to focus shift on the 50L on POTN, switched to Nikon because of the problems he had with 50L and 1D Mk IV. That lasted a little over a year, when he switched back to Canon, about half a year ago. He recently acquired a new 50L - zero focus shift.
Furthermore, focus shift is/was limited to a very specific range, namely about MFD to 1.8 m, only at apertures from F/1.4 to about F/2.8.
However, it looks like Canon has this problem entirely under control now, and anybody who shoots with a 50L for a while, and likes the 50 mm FL, wouldn't want to miss it.
Same here... <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=' ' /> and I tested 5 different specimens over a period of a year and a half, when things were still quite bad. The specimen I still have, which sits as main lens on my 5D II, only had some constant back focus rather than focus shift and was calibrated to perfection by Canon, even if it took Canon a second go to get it perfect.
Other than that, most fast lenses (F/1.4 and faster) show focus shift, unless they have perfect superapochromatic correction. You need to get to know a lens well so you can deal with it, if you are after the rendering such a lens provides.
HTH, kind regards, Wim
Gear: Canon EOS R with 3 primes and 2 zooms, 4 EF-R adapters, Canon EOS 5 (analog), 9 Canon EF primes, a lone Canon EF zoom, 2 extenders, 2 converters, tubes; Olympus OM-D 1 Mk II & Pen F with 12 primes, 6 zooms, and 3 Metabones EF-MFT adapters ....
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